Why did they fall off after 1979?
They had essentially the same roster that had done so well in '79 (#2 in points allowed, #5 in yards allowed, #3 in takeaways), yet even in 1980 they weren't quite as effective.
And of course as the years went on, they really REALLY didn't get better. (Heck, even with Fred Dean in 1980, they were a bit worse).
How do you explain it? Was their D-coordinator that bad? Was it pass or run defense that was a bigger liability?
Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
It seemed to me (from watching some old games) that the pass defense was a bigger liability, especially in 1981.
In 1979 and 80, they had Jackie Simpson as DC. In 1980, they gave up 327 points (18th in the NFL), and they were sixth-best in both passing and rushing yards given up. The next year, they lost Fred Dean, and they had a new coordinator (Jack Pardee). As a result, those numbers really took a drop.
The 1981 Charger defense allowed 390 points (third worst in the league), were the 27th rated defense in total yards, and rated 28th in passing. They still had Buchanon and Mike Williams at CB (although Buchanon was in his 10th year), but they had musical safeties with Pine Edwards, Pete Shaw, and Bob Gregor.
1982 brought a new DC (Tom Bass) from Tampa, and he switched to a 3-4 alignment. It also brought in some new players, like safeties Tim Fox and Bruce Laird, and Linebackers David Lewis and Dewey Selmon from Tampa (I think that Jeff Siemon also signed with SD that year, but must have been cut or retired because he didn't play a game).
There was slight improvement in the rankings in 82, but in the ensuing years, defense would remain a sore spot in San Diego. They just didn't seem to get the talent they needed until the early-90's.
In 1979 and 80, they had Jackie Simpson as DC. In 1980, they gave up 327 points (18th in the NFL), and they were sixth-best in both passing and rushing yards given up. The next year, they lost Fred Dean, and they had a new coordinator (Jack Pardee). As a result, those numbers really took a drop.
The 1981 Charger defense allowed 390 points (third worst in the league), were the 27th rated defense in total yards, and rated 28th in passing. They still had Buchanon and Mike Williams at CB (although Buchanon was in his 10th year), but they had musical safeties with Pine Edwards, Pete Shaw, and Bob Gregor.
1982 brought a new DC (Tom Bass) from Tampa, and he switched to a 3-4 alignment. It also brought in some new players, like safeties Tim Fox and Bruce Laird, and Linebackers David Lewis and Dewey Selmon from Tampa (I think that Jeff Siemon also signed with SD that year, but must have been cut or retired because he didn't play a game).
There was slight improvement in the rankings in 82, but in the ensuing years, defense would remain a sore spot in San Diego. They just didn't seem to get the talent they needed until the early-90's.
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Rupert Patrick
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Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
I've made this argument before, which I have referred to as the Dan Fouts syndrome. here's how it works: A team that is heavily reliant on the pass and can literally score at will comes up with a new wrinkle or a new scheme or a hot new QB (San Diego in 1979, Miami in 1984) will often have great success with it for the first season or so, but after that, their opponents learn to play the same game they are playing (ie the big pass game) and before long these offensive powerhouses turn into 8-8 teams whose defensive passing stats closely resemble their stellar offensive passing stats. They will have the best offense and worst defense in the league. There are exceptions to this rule - teams with balanced offenses, a strong rushing attack, will overcome this syndrome because they can control the clock; big passing games like Fouts and Marino have trouble doing so. In Marino's career he only had one 1.000-yard rusher. A team like the 49ers in their heyday, as an example, always had a Roger Craig or Ricky Watters and were more of a short-medium passing game. Even the Rams of the Kurt Warner era had Marshall Faulk who could run and catch screens although Warner had a cannon arm. Elway didn't really put it all together in Denver until he had Terrell Davis, he needed a great running back to take the pressure off him; he couldn't do it all by himself.
"Every time you lose, you die a little bit. You die inside. Not all your organs, maybe just your liver." - George Allen
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BD Sullivan
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Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
Coryell again fell victim to a cheap owner, with T Russ Washington holding out until mid-August in 1980. DE Fred Dean stayed away to try and renegotiate his contract and didn't return until he had missed two regular season games.
The next year, John Jefferson was sent to the Packers, followed two weeks later by Dean to the 49ers. During training camp that year, DT Big Hands Johnson and LB Woody Lowe were on the verge of walking out before getting their contract re-worked--one had deferred money paid that year. In addition, Kellen Winslow's contract also was adjusted in some manner.
During the 1981 training camp, a dinner for the team's fan club had to be cancelled after players said they would boycott it to show supports of players like Jefferson and Dean.
While only a portion of these players were on defense, the overall toxic environment that surrounded the team didn't help matters. Even with all this swirling around them, the Chargers were coming off a trip to the AFC title game and would play in it again that year.
The next year, John Jefferson was sent to the Packers, followed two weeks later by Dean to the 49ers. During training camp that year, DT Big Hands Johnson and LB Woody Lowe were on the verge of walking out before getting their contract re-worked--one had deferred money paid that year. In addition, Kellen Winslow's contract also was adjusted in some manner.
During the 1981 training camp, a dinner for the team's fan club had to be cancelled after players said they would boycott it to show supports of players like Jefferson and Dean.
While only a portion of these players were on defense, the overall toxic environment that surrounded the team didn't help matters. Even with all this swirling around them, the Chargers were coming off a trip to the AFC title game and would play in it again that year.
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74_75_78_79_
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Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
After '79, SD wouldn't again be a top 10 defense in pts-allowed until '89 when Henning came along and Leslie O'Neal returned to full-strength/Pro Bowl-form from his previous injury. Burt Grossman came onboard as well.
Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
A departure that hasn't been mentioned yet is FS Mike Fuller leaving after the 1980 season. He was kind of the "leader" of the back 7, and also returned punts and held for kicks (at times). Not very big, not an all-pro talent, but a good, underrated player. He went to the Bengals and then faced off against Fred Dean's Niners in the Super Bowl.
In Todd Tobias' book about Air Coryell, several black players mentioned they loved playing for Jackie Simpson, but despised Jack Pardee. They said that Pardee lost respect when he insisted on playing white guys at safety...which I assume was a reference to the awful Bob Gregor. It seemed to insinuate a racist element, which might not have really been true of Pardee, but I do think the Chargers DBs lacked athleticism regardless of skin color. Edwards and Buchanon were old, Shaw and Williams weren't fast, Gregor was a huge liability, then the Chargers brought in a stream of guys like Ken Greene, Bruce Laird & Tim Fox. By 1984 the menacing Charger Power D-line of 1980 was playing for the 49ers.
In Todd Tobias' book about Air Coryell, several black players mentioned they loved playing for Jackie Simpson, but despised Jack Pardee. They said that Pardee lost respect when he insisted on playing white guys at safety...which I assume was a reference to the awful Bob Gregor. It seemed to insinuate a racist element, which might not have really been true of Pardee, but I do think the Chargers DBs lacked athleticism regardless of skin color. Edwards and Buchanon were old, Shaw and Williams weren't fast, Gregor was a huge liability, then the Chargers brought in a stream of guys like Ken Greene, Bruce Laird & Tim Fox. By 1984 the menacing Charger Power D-line of 1980 was playing for the 49ers.
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nicefellow31
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Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
Interesting that the Chargers OC in 1980 was Joe Gibbs who replaced Jack Pardee as head coach in Washington and Pardee goes on to be the Chargers DC. What a great trade for my Skins!Bryan wrote: In Todd Tobias' book about Air Coryell, several black players mentioned they loved playing for Jackie Simpson, but despised Jack Pardee.
Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
It's crazy that Pardee was a disaster defensively for the Chargers considering he had some quality defensive units with Washington/Houston.
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JohnTurney
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Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
I think there were also injuries in secondary in 1981, Willie Buchanon played some safety that season, and Shaw and Edwards missed some time. Allan Ellis had to start because of injuries and he didn't seem like he was much good, he never played after 1981.
Losing Dean was clearly the big loss. I guess they went with London King over Preson because of size, but in 1979 Preston had a great year. Not as good in 1980 then he's not the starter.
Losing Dean was clearly the big loss. I guess they went with London King over Preson because of size, but in 1979 Preston had a great year. Not as good in 1980 then he's not the starter.
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Gary Najman
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Re: Chargers defense of Air Coryell Era post-1979
Ellis was a Pro Bowler just four years earlier with the Bears.JohnTurney wrote:I think there were also injuries in secondary in 1981, Willie Buchanon played some safety that season, and Shaw and Edwards missed some time. Allan Ellis had to start because of injuries and he didn't seem like he was much good, he never played after 1981.
Losing Dean was clearly the big loss. I guess they went with London King over Preson because of size, but in 1979 Preston had a great year. Not as good in 1980 then he's not the starter.